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notcalebsheridan

10-07-2006, 10:58 PM

Sorry, I don't know of an AB HH converter, so i

Stage #464118293: Holdem Normal $2/$4 - 2006-10-07 22:26:47 (ET)
Table: LEGACY DR. (Real Money) Seat #3 is the dealer
Seat 3 - BUTTON ($14 in chips)
Seat 4 - SB ($49.25 in chips)
Seat 5 - HERO ($129 in chips)
Seat 6 - UTG ($211.63 in chips)
Seat 7 - MP ($36.25 in chips)
Seat 1 - CO ($33.62 in chips)
SB - Posts small blind $1
HERO - Posts big blind $2
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to HERO [diamond10 diamondK ]
UTG - Folds
MP - Calls $2
CO - Calls $2
BUTTON - Folds
SB - Calls $1
HERO - Checks
*** FLOP *** [diamond4 spade10 diamond8]
SB - Checks
HERO - Checks
MP - Bets $2
CO - Calls $2
SB - Calls $2
HERO - Raises $4 to $4
MP - Calls $2
CO - Calls $2
SB - Calls $2
*** TURN *** [diamond4 spade10 diamond8] [spade4]
SB - Checks
HERO - Bets $4
MP - Calls $4
CO - Folds
SB - Calls $4
*** RIVER *** [diamond4 spade10 diamond8 spade4] [diamond9]
SB - Checks
HERO - Bets $4
MP - Calls $4
SB - Raises $8 to $8
HERO - .......

1) Preflop: check seems obvious... is obvious right here?
2) flop: check-raise seems very obvious again -trying to get as much in the pot here as i can
3) turn: board pairs, i was going to bet/call with a hand that still has redraws and great strength alone
4) river: is a call ok? obviously i'm not folding -do i need to value 3-bet? What do i do if he caps?

I didn't have a read on the SB, but my read on MP was that he was betting just about every flop and generally aggressive, i was surprised he didn't three-bet me on the flop

This seems like a straightforward hand, but river play kills me, i feel like i'm either missing bets or spewing on hands like this. I feel like the SB can't be bluffing here, but the only hands that beat me as played would be Adxd.. I think anything that hit the second four would be raising that turn.. So this looks like a bluff, but it would be a stupid bluff with two other people in such a large pot -so i'd have to put him on AdXd but then would he really raise here on a paired board?

I get lost on rivers like these, such odd play

Matt

10-07-2006, 11:27 PM

You've played the hand perfectly so far. It's doubtful that the SB has a full house. If he did, he probably would have check-raised the turn. He may have made a full house on the river, but his play suggests that he caught a flush. He could have Ad-xd, but he could also have a weaker flush; many players bet too aggressively with weak made hands. I would just call here. If you're beaten, you won't lose an extra bet. Just calling may also encourage the MP player to overcall; there's a good chance he would fold if you three-bet. There are times when going for overcalls is more profitable than raising.

Ed Miller has a great section on river play in Small Stakes Hold'em. It's must-reading for all limit hold'em players. I'll be happy to lend you my copy, but it's worth buying. I've read mine at least three times.

You can use this hand convertor for both Absolute and Full Tilt: http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter/. It can be a little temperamental, but it works most of the time.

notcalebsheridan

10-08-2006, 03:47 AM

bluebayou

10-08-2006, 06:11 AM

i think calling the river raise is ok. he could be slowplaying the fh and then with capping the action you wont win anything.

i dont think he has higher flush, but maybe trips with an ace kicker.

so go for it und show no fear.

blue

Matt

10-08-2006, 06:28 PM

i own and have read SSHE

About the hand -it's not results based, just a strange hand I had where I felt the play was a little fishy on everyone's part and i was a little lost on the river -thinking back on the hand it's obviously better to flat call assuming sb doesn't cap without atleast the nut flush

Flat call:
-when i'm beat: lose 1 bets (his raise)
-when i'm ahead: make 1 bet off mp (i call, mp overcalls)

raise:
-when i'm beat: lose 2 bets (my 3-bet and his cap)
-when i'm ahead: make 1 bet off sb (mp folds, sb flat calls my 3-bet)

i think this is the best way to analyze the river action, if i'm way off please tell me -it's 3:45am

fwiw: MP overcalled, SB showed a bluff (?) with JTo and MP showed A8o i believe

Well played. I think your analysis of the hand is entirely correct. You gained just as much by calling as you would have by raising. Have you posted this hand elsewhere, perhaps on the 2+2 forums? I'd be interested to know what others have to say.

I should've guessed that you have read SSHE. Later on, I'll post a list of other limit hold'em resources in the Book/DVD forum. You may own some of those as well, but I'm hoping it will help others who are interested in the game.

Steve-O

10-17-2008, 04:17 PM

I think this is a simple call. I would be shocked if he slowplayed a boat because he would have been able to keep everyone involved on the turn. Chances are he has a weak flush, but I'm not going to re-raise in case I'm beat.

tsrumler

10-17-2008, 05:55 PM

The only reason I would flat call here is fearing the SB had a boat, I think he at least has a set. The reason I say this is because he was in the small blind so he could have something like a 4-8 off. He was in the big blind so he was already half forced into the pot with the force, then just limped in because of odds hoping to hit his garbage. Thats the only reason I would call in that certain scenario and not raise. You already have a pretty good pot built, and your potentially saving yourself some money if your hand is second best. I def dont think he has the nut flush here, its either a set, or a boat.